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Aug '20
It might sound strange but Iโ€™ve have only seen this movie in full recently. I did see parts of it on TV before but never triggered me enough to watch the whole movie. Also I donโ€™t really have a high opinion on James Cameron as a director. I have seen his first movie Piranha II the Spawning like a week ago which was rather dreadful. Ok Iโ€™m quite a fan of the original I must admit. Furthermore I have seen Titanic and Avatar (aka Dancing with the Smurfs) while visually stunning they are rather empty in other aspects IMO. Given its Cameron I had enough reason to believe Terminator was going to be simplistic in story, dialogue and flat characters. That was indeed so in the end but at least The Terminator does have some memorable parts that are cool and not cringe-worthy like many of the scenes in the aforementioned flicks.

Now why would I actually want to watch a movie that I probably not going to like much. Itโ€™s not that I was running out of options nor that I just get gratification out of pissing of the fans. I know some people are rather attached and passionate about their favorite movies but in the end itโ€™s a movie, the creation of someone who you in most cases have no relation with, something abstract and acted on a piece of celluloid. First there was Box indirectly recommending it and even though he did have the feeling I might not like it he would still would like to know why. So itโ€™s for him mostly. When I feel like I can be elaborate on the pros and cons. I myself hate reviews like it was crap or it was a masterpiece, those are useless. That doesnโ€™t trigger any discussion and a board if for discussion. Leave the superficial stuff to platforms like facebook and fansites I say. Secondly I like myself a good challenge. Since the 132 years of movies chalelnge Iโ€™m hosting on the Dutch movie board is still running I had the category โ€œurban areaโ€ where I could fit in The Terminator. And yes who knows maybe after seeing this movie I might actually end up not hating it maybe even liking it. Maybe I would even understand the vague definition of โ€œgeneral consensusโ€ (which some might confuse with general truth I guess) or even become part of the elite which recognizes great movies without needing to explain why because the average rating is the proof it canโ€™t be bad and those who disagree are simply wrong. Actually I do wish that was the case so I wouldnโ€™t be the party pooper so often or the contrarian or the one who thinks itโ€™s cool to bash popular movies because they must be bad or just to piss of the fans. But one canโ€™t help what he likes and dislikes and unfortunately there is considering movies a lot I do not like. Search another hobby like reading or so nah I donโ€™t have the patience. Besides I still think itโ€™s fun hunting for that gem even if I have to go through dozens of movies that eventually became a miss. Ok, anyone who feels bitten in the ass now, donโ€™t this is all meant in good fun.

Now finally onto the movie. I already mentioned most of its weak parts. I donโ€™t really mind the straightforward simplistic story. I mean I have seen the Matrix long ago and I wonder what was the point of this over explaining the whole damn thing while fans are going to watch it for the action anyway. A small cast is handy too there is just 3 characters you need to memorize: Sarah (the target), Kyle (the protector) and the Terminator. The others are merely attributes needed to fill up the world and the story. Talking about fillers even though it takes a while before we get to some longer action scenes there is actually few scenes that would pad or stretch out the movie to an unbearable length. They might have cut about 10 minutes but the intention of the movie is clear pretty quick. Arnie the terminator has one mission: destroy Sarah Connor. Sure there is the dialogue between Sarah and Kyle with flash backs that do slow things down but understandable the viewer wants to know why 2 beings from the future travel to the past. Sarah will eventually become the mother of a future rebellion leader names John Connor. Since he is bearing his motherโ€™s name the identity of the father remains unknown, well at the end you will know that as well or you might even guess it before. I donโ€™t think it was that surprising, future romances are often easy to predict. In the end that makes no sense at all though and IMO virtually impossible but name one movie where time travel actions can be explained with bullet-proof certainty there are no flaws. Itโ€™s a movie, donโ€™t overanalyze Box would say I guess.

This reminds me actually of Back to the Future possible the worst culprit to have time travel actions make sense. Donโ€™t get me wrong I absolutely love the first movie since it was the perfect ending (minus the part Doc eventually taking Marty and his gf to the future to initiate the next installment). While enjoyable in parts those sequels were not needed IMO. I particularly didnโ€™t like Doc eventually remained in the Wild West not to mention the changes they made should have come back in their face.

Back to the Terminator. The Terminator himself or itself since it is just a genderless machine. Kyle refers to the Terminator as a cyborg. I always thought a cyborg was a creature being a mixture of human and mechanical parts. Sure Terminator is a robot with human flesh around it. But is this skin really human flesh, it seemed more synthetic to me. Also he had no emotions, he just did what was instructed: kill Sarah Connor. He didnโ€™t target others unless they would walk in his way. So there isnโ€™t much acting involved in this character. I donโ€™t think Arnie is a good actor but I do think he really shines in action roles. There are exceptions where he actually goes out of this comfort zone like Maggie where he did play the caring father convincingly. Personally I donโ€™t think the Terminator rates as his best action role I think Conan and Commando are better not only because he actually is the good guy and does have a personality I just think they are better action movies. I actually need to revisit Conan. Oh yeah there is Red Sonja too but that one is rather dumb IMO. Anyway to me he is the best action actor.

Now the favorite parts. The โ€˜Illโ€™ be backโ€™ scene isnโ€™t particularly good or memorable but eventually became a popular quote among young people here (and other parts of the world I bet) certainly in that typical English with German accent. It was amusing to link it to images even though in the end I mostly remember the quote and how he says it. Other action scenes are rather standard fare, shooting and car chasing. Itโ€™s the last 40 minutes however that the movie becomes more engaging where we actually get to the parts that could be described as (graphical) horror; Actually the scene where Arnie starts poking in his flesh and eye with a knife was one I did see before. Iโ€™m not a person who is squeamish or disgusted easily but eyes woah such scenes I find painful to watch. Than there is the scene where Arnie shoos away the boy in the truck with a robotic dry โ€˜get outโ€™. I can understand wit that face the boy didnโ€™t hesitate to follow this order. Finally we come to the best parts when the terminator gets burnt and shows his true form: a skeleton robot with glowing red eyes. Yes the movements are wooden and robotic and clumsy (he didnโ€™t have that problem in human flesh) and may I say pretty dated now. However it is the moment where to me he is most threatening especially when only haf a robot he still keeps going and that hand reaching out for Sarahโ€™s throat.

In the end Iโ€™m happy to finally have seen it in full. Does it invite me to see the sequels, not really. I actually did see a sequel in theatre with a friend who does like action movies but other than the beginning where Terminator Arnie asks a male stripper for the guyโ€™s clothes (pretty similar to the beginning of the original movie) which includes funny sunglasses which Arnie tramples I donโ€™t remember anything about it anymore. Besides Onyx already told me the first one is the darkest more horror so letโ€™s leave it at that. I might try the arcade game again (Terminator 2 I think) I remember this being fun playing in the arcade halls with a friend shooting at the terminators.



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Snowy_Owl says:
#1

Aug '20
Thank you for you post! I enjoyed reading it. I would say at least watch the second one at one point. It's, IMO, the best in the series. Onyx was right, the first one is the one that is more horror, but the second one is more action, and just really awesome to watch!


So when I first watched this movie, I'm pretty sure box wanted to kill me. I just kept laughing at Arnie. When his eyebrows burnt off, and his face started decaying I just laughed every time he was on screen. Box said he was supposed to be scary, but at that point it was just funny. I still laugh every time I watch it now. The whole look before he shows his true look is just super comical!

I'm glad you finally watched it!


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Johan_WoW says:
#4, Reply to #1

Aug '20 *
Well I wouldn't call Arnie funny even though he does sound phony at times. But I had that with the original Evil Dead. I was surprised it was meant to be scary while I thought the intention was comedy. yeah ok the sequels were more comedy but I found the second even more annoying to sit through. I wouldn't even want to bother with the third. I enjoyed the remake a lot though.

Well more action over horror is not really a good motivation for one that loves horror and doesn't really like action movies.


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Snowy_Owl says:
#7, Reply to #4

Aug '20
Lol it wasn't that I thought he was funny, it's just that he looked so funny. With no eyebrows especially. I just kept laughing every time he was on screen. Box just kept giving me his death stare.

And yeah, 2 is way more action, and long. So you might not like it. However, it is the best of the series. But to each their own lol.

I love the evil dead series. The comedy aspects did not bother me. I do gotta say there are points where I like the show more than I like the movies lol


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Box_a_Hair says:
#2

Aug '20
Going by the other Cameron movies you watched, I can definitely understand why you thought this movie would be garbage. Piranha II is regarded as his worst movie and people generally omit that from his filmography. Titanic may be a "cinematic achievement", but it's really just a big budget chick flick romance, and I'm perfectly fine with never watching it again. And Avatar? I'll never know why that movie has a following. The 3D was great, but everything else was stupid.



As far as time-travel movies go, I never want to assume that this world starts in a time-loop where the past is always dependent on the future. I always believe that there were other unseen acts before this movie that led to time being tied in a knot like this, because it's fun to theorize.

Arnold is amazing, and while many claim he doesn't act in this, I think he plays a cold emotionless robot perfectly (if you can call that acting). I very much appreciate his more serious acting attempts too, like Maggie and Aftermath, because they mean so much more after seeing so many other movies where he simply plays himself.

I can go on and on about how much I love the mood and vibes of the first movie, but the even more general consensus is that Terminator 2 is 10 times better than the first one. The other sequel you described watching was T3, which is a very shallow movie, but if you wanted to leave this series on a high note, I'd highly recommend (even more so than T1) the sequel, Terminator 2: Judgment Day.

T2 is basically the coolest movie ever made, and I can't tell you how much it affected my youth in the early 90s. This movie WAS my youth, and I was obsessed. I'd only developed an obsession with T1 after watching T2 a hundred times. Everything about the sequel is much more polished and in-depth, and Linda Hamilton should have won an Oscar for that movie. Her intensity in that movie rivals Arnold's intensity in the first.


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Johan_WoW says:
#5, Reply to #2

Aug '20
Well I might give T2 a shot one day but I'm more inclined for a re-watch of Conan the Barbarian which I haven't seen since I was 12 or so. I remember it had some gruesome scenes.


And Avatar I think when it was released the whole 3D was a big hype. I think there were lots of people who went to watch it for that even though they knew the story was going to be crap. The whole 3D TV didn't really take off (fortunately).


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Ballz says:
#3

Aug '20
I actually didn't hate Piranha II when I watched it a couple years ago. It's a bad movie, but I'd watch it again before I'd watch Titanic again or Avatar even once.

Anyway, I agree with a lot of what you've said about Terminator, including Commando being a better movie. I do like Terminator a lot though, have since I was a kid. It was one of the first R-rated movies I was allowed to watch.

Terminator 2 is good and I'd say give it a chance based on that, but I'm really not sure you'd like it. In addition to having less horror elements (there's a lot of good action though), it's longer than the first movie by about 30 minutes or 45 with the director's cut. You seem to not like movies that go on for too long.


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Johan_WoW says:
#6, Reply to #3

Aug '20
Never seen Avatar? Keep it that way. You would only waste time you invest better in watching a good movie.


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Snowy_Owl says:
#8, Reply to #3

Aug '20
So avatar is the only movie I have ever walked out on at the theaters. It was so boring. I have never finished it, and I never will lol


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Tromafreak says:
#9

Aug '20 *
Glad to hear you didn't hate it. I love this series almost as much as Fuad. And I would also encourage you to check out the next one just to see how much better a part 2 can actually be. It's up there with Bood Feast 2, for sure. Hell, I think you and Markus both should go ahead and check out the rest of the series and then have a knock down drag out debate on here. Of course with our luck, you 2 would probably hate most of the sequels equally.

Oh, and you all are fucking crazy. Titanic and Avatar are awesome!


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Johan_WoW says:
#10, Reply to #9

Aug '20
I didn't know Markus hasn't seen any of the Terminator sequels. Given his reaction it seemed he was a fan of the whole series.

I did watch Orca (1977) again today and oh the temptation to start a topic comparing it with Jaws (with Orca as clear winner) was big but hey that might actually be considered provocation again.
Actually I would rather hear from Markus what he thinks of a movie like Blood Feast 2 but I'm afraid he wouldn't even consider watching it.


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Box_a_Hair says:
#11, Reply to #10

Aug '20
Blood Feast 2 and Terminator 2 are the greatest sequels of all time (along with Psycho II). I've never seen Orca, so you should make a post to convince me.


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Johan_WoW says:
#14, Reply to #11

Aug '20
Depends how much you are a Jaws fan and can take someone criticizing it? What am I asking I think you can take criticism pretty well.


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Box_a_Hair says:
#17, Reply to #14

Aug '20
I used to think Jaws was overrated. I'd see it as number 1 on top-horror lists and it baffled me, but over the years, I've gained a great appreciation for it. At the same time, it's still a movie about a killer shark, which by today's standards is rather laughable.

If you can't stand the heatteeth, stay out of the kitchenwater.


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markus-san says:
#12, Reply to #10

Aug '20 *
I don't care for the two sequels I've seen and I flat out refuse to watch Genisys because I believe it fucks with the original story far too much. I only care for the first two movies. Enough is enough with these damn sequels (and that goes for Alien prequels too).

BTW, I believe you like Alien (one of the few "popular" movies you do enjoy!) and Aliens is a Cameron movie with a strong adolescent female character in it.. so how come you're not considering that one?

You're quite welcome to start the topic but I think you're already trying to be rather provocative by claiming Orca as the "clear winner". Never see it but yeah, I naturally have my doubts of course (especially in terms of something like the score being a "clear winner"). The only thing I will say on this matter is: Black and white dolphins are just not as scary as Great White Sharks. I mean have you ever seen Free Willy? Pretty sure they've never made a movie about a boy befriending a Great White since...

Well Troma and Nicko both enjoy Blood Feast 2, so who knows, maybe I would too. I presume I don't need to see the original one first? You know I've ended up watching the likes of the Guinea Pig movies, the August Underground series, Human Centipede II etc., solely for the gore or out of curiousity for how disturbing a movie is (defintiely not the sophistication), so don't presume I would never consider watching something...

Let's face it,. The only movies we are ever going to mostly agree on are the old black & white movies of the 20s, 30s, 40s and 60s. After this period, we're pretty much chalk and cheese when it comes to preference.


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Johan_WoW says:
#13, Reply to #12

Aug '20
Aliens is ok but it can't touch the original which is more of a slow burn and has more tension while Aliens is much more of an action movie. Ok the additions of little Newt and the good robot guy are cool but still Ripley as the main character in the first (and also the next 2 movies) was good enough for me.

Well I'm rather quickly provocative in your eyes, guess you are bit touchy as well? emoticon

Free Willy came much later than Orca so the comparison there is not quite fair IMO. Those family movies already skewed your vision on them. They are not black and white dolphins either but whales (they are both mammals that's true), killer whales if you actually would mess around with them. And also they are more powerful than sharks. If you saw their teeth they don't really look that dolphin like as you make them to be. Jaws also gave people a skewed look on sharks. They aren't active manhunters that has been proven over and over again. In fact I don't think they are scary at all well until they show their teeth that is. Thing is you can make any animal scary applying the right make-up, techniques etc. But die hard Jaws fans will be hard to find any other shark/killer fish movie just as enjoyable. So yeah others don't make a chance. I already feel here that you hesitate to watch "Orka" and expect not to like it that much or maybe not at all. But as long as you didn't watch it you can't make a comparison and I don't find great and white dolphin scary because of Free Willy is void.

And yes I can say Orca is the best of the 2, I have seen both even if in the end that is just my personal opinion and preference. That has nothing to do with a movie being popular or high rated. But I guess we cleared that one up now.

No you don't need to see the original Blood Feast. In fact I would advise you not to. I know some people actually turned of HG Lewis movies after seeing it and not giving any of his other movies. If you enjoy BF 2 you might try his more trashy stuff if not they are not advisable.


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markus-san says:
#15, Reply to #13

Aug '20 *
The orca is the largest member of the dolphin family. It is not a whale at all. I guess when they named it "killer whale" it sounded better than "killer dolphin" and probably had something to do with their immense size. Anyway, you can Google it if you don't believe me emoticon.

You're right about Jaws giving people a skewed look on sharks, but then I am sure Orca was just a "cash-in" on the success of Jaws as it came two years later and would have provided just as skewed look at orcas. My point was, you can make a family friendly movie about a kid befriending an orca, but you can't make one about a kid befriending a shark. In fact you can do that convincingly with many mammals (however unrealistic it might be in real life) but when it comes to fish (pirahnas, sharks), reptiles (snakes, crocodiles), insects and arachnids... they can't be befriended and this is the reason they probably appear more frightening on the surface to most people. A shark's fin appearing above the water would definitely frighten most people out swimming in the sea, even if for you personally it would have to show it's teeth first. Pretty sure you wouldn't want to stick around regardless. Is this irrational fear because of Jaws? Probably but there are more human deaths around the world from sharks than than orcas. As for seals.. probably 50/50.

I will try to watch Blood Feast 2. Nicko said to avoid the original too. Sadly it does not appear to be available on Blu-ray or HD streaming unlike the original. I guess DVD quality will have to suffice.


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Tromafreak says:
#16, Reply to #15

Aug '20
I, personally, wouldn't advise someone who has interest in BF2 to skip the original. You wouldn't be THAT confused or anything, but you're not gonna get how clever it is either. It's a bit of a parody. The original is slow but it's not fuckin' Frozen Flesh or anything. emoticon


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Johan_WoW says:
#18, Reply to #16

Aug '20 *
I'm afraid that if he hates the original he might not even want to bother with the sequel...

Not sure what he would not get about it? It has plenty of references to other horror flicks, Halloween for example (yeah the Halloween movie which I'm not very fond of). The inclusion of someone like John Waters as a priest, the music. It's all part of the charm which I think Markus will appreciate.


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Tromafreak says:
#21, Reply to #18

Aug '20
I'm not saying he (or anyone who hasn't seen the original) couldn't find it ammusing cuz there's a lot to like if you appreciate that sort of thing, but if you haven't seen the original or even an HGL at all and aren't a fan, I can't imagine this movie holding much meaning. "Some old guy made a movie for the first time in a while, big deal". I'm not suggesting he not watch it so much as pointing out that watching 2 before the original defeats half the purpose.


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Johan_WoW says:
#19, Reply to #15

Aug '20
Strange that orcas are classified as dolphins, they look rather different from the blue finned creatures which I think about when talking about dolphins. Anyway I don't think it does matter when talking about movies which creature is most responsible for human deaths to be scariest, I think that's largely a matter of personal fears. Personally I find piranha the scariest, little but they hunt in group. And perhaps there is too many shark movies that movies about other killer fish/water creatures are a welcome change
Oh and just saying an Orca also has this fin resembling the one of a shark. You might say just an orca or a lovely dolphin but I think I would take no chances and leave the water.

Oh and you don't need blu ray quality for BF2 it's not Avatar or Titanic :)




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